The delusions of people today

[sh]

I believe, today all people categorize themselves as either Believers, Agnostics or Atheists.

The believer believes on sheer faith that there is a God, and a Heaven, and plenty of other mumbo jumbo that he/she doesn't understand.

The agnostic believes that it is impossible to know if there is anything beyond this material existence.

Last but not least, the atheist believes that there is nothing beyond what he/she sees with his/her own eyes.

These are, I believe, three flavors of the same delusion.

I don't think it really matters what we believe, as long as that belief does not hinder us from seeking the truth and understanding the truth.

And to all my believer, agnostic and atheist friends, I say: you are fooling no one but your selves.

Think! Don't be stupid.

-f

[sh]

The atheists and agnostics believe their stand shows that they are critical thinkers and too smart for BS.

The believers also believe the same thing.

-f

[sh]

"Nothing is true, everything is permitted." -- Hassan e Sabbah

-f

[The Late Mitchell Warren]

I tend to think of atheists as reverse Christians. Most of them are just as narrow-minded as Christians (And all other forms of religions) and insist on spreading their own propaganda and affirmations.

They have their own surrogate gods and their own surrogate Christian lifestyle. Whatever they don't believe in terms of biblical promise, they make up with in absurd mountains of faith in science presumed.

I suppose I am in between full agnostic and believer. I believe in something unconventional. I don't know what it is precisely. I think I'm a new age Deist of some sort, though I have family ties to Christianity.

[The Late Mitchell Warren]

I recently had a dream which was somewhat profound for me:

"I was at the end of my life and God, or a God-like entity, asked me if I wanted to see what happened after the big "fade out." I reluctantly said yes. I saw a new perspective, that of a child just born, as if looking out its eyes. This child was somehow my reincarnated self. However, he was not just a random person, but the newborn infant of someone that I currently know. I had the right to find out who it was...but something about knowing frightened me, so I opted not to know. I felt relieved to know something did happen after the fade out, but also felt great anxiety about my reincarnated self, as if it was something unnatural, or perhaps there was a great revelation about who it was that was horrific. One of the very few vivid dreams I've had..."

I don't actually believe in reincarnation, but I believe in something to the effect of mysticism, an unknown, esoteric future.

[sh]

That's funny, Mitch.

But, personally, I don't label myself with nonsense. I'm a man. A self. That is all.

Edit: not your dream, but the post above.

-f

[The Late Mitchell Warren]

I suppose "consciousness" is one of the issues that really bother me

I do have a morbid fear of death and the consciousness or lack thereof creates a phobia in me. Where does it all go? How can one reconcile consciousness and then no consciousness?

What is the answer to reconciliation?

[sh]

About your dream, I've had similar revelations. (or hallucinations)

I once saw myself asleep, in a place that resembled a womb. It was a place filled with beauty and love. It was a very warm and comfortable setting and just being there was enjoyable. All kinds of "nourishment" was available all around me. I pictured all kinds of fruits of different colours and tastes. I saw juicy steaks and kababs. And I saw warm bread, with milk.

Then I saw myself growing in that place. I was changing. Going through certain motions. At certain moments it seemed like I was going to "wake up" but I really didn't want to leave that place. It was really heaven to me.

Then I saw the end. The end was birth. But it was also death.

At that point I realized that the earth was the environment I had perceived as a "womb."

Yes, the earth with its joys and longings, with its music and mountains, with its seas and deserts, is my womb-paradise.

I believe I'm still in the belly at this point. Growing, until I'm ready to die. (or be born)

-f

[sh]

I hope this makes sense. ^^^

And I really appreciated your description of your dream, Mitch. Thanks, really.

-f

[karlsie]

I won't say i'm agnostic, only that i don't really know what happens after death, especially since science counts near death experiences as hallucinations triggered by the oxygen deprivation or trauma. I have been nearly dead after a tragic car accident that killed my companion and one other, but the memory i have is of flying with these companions until we came to a wall. They were allowed to pass through a gate while i was told to go back and take care of my two children who were injured, yet alive.

I had a friend once who believed we were all neurons running around in the brain of Mother Earth. We send messages, and sometimes the messages are received and carried on. Sometimes they are forgotten and the neural pathway slumbers. He was so whacked out in terms of being able to communicate with him, he ended up with the nickname "Spaceship", yet i still wonder if maybe he knew something we didn't.

[sh]

Isn't it funny that we don't have a field of scientific inquiry and study devoted to death?

What could be more important than knowing for sure what happens after death?

It's also funny to me, that those people who have undertaken this task of their own accord, are mocked and disbelieved.

As Azazel demonstrated downstairs, (on the main site) Today, if you don't have a certificate from the establishment, your ideas are worth nothing. If you do, however, have a certificate, people will believe your words on sheer faith.

A very close acquaintance of mine, an MD with a successful private practice, is a great example of what I have in mind.

This lady sees a great many number of patients weekly. Her whole life is devoted to her patients, most of whom she knows individually and treats with utmost respect. This is rare among doctors in Iran, who usually treat their patients like insignificant peons.

This lady actually takes the time to explain to her patients what is wrong with them, in simple terms so they can understand. Whereas, most doctors look at their patients as if they were so ignorant and stupid that they could never understand the sophistication of the medical profession. As such, most doctors will laugh at the idea of explaining anything to their patients, who they see as no different than cattle.

This lady, together with all other doctors, are trusted implicitly by all people. The doctor's word is equivalent to the prophet's word. And so the vast majority of people will do anything the doctor tells them to do.

I've discussed the topic of psychedelics with this woman on a few occasions. Her reaction has always been a very self-righteous tone of dismissal.

She states, with the most holier-than-thou attitude you could imagine, that she knows for a fact that psychedelics cause insanity.

When confronted with the question of whether she knows this from first-hand experience, her response is that she doesn't need to take poison to know its effects, because all the symptoms of psychedelic use are well-defined and properly outlined in her medical books.

When asked if she believes it is proper behavior to pass judgement on something one has no personal experience with, she responds with a defensive and indignant tone, that she knows everything she needs to know about psychedelics.

So, what I'm trying to point out, is that our best doctors, whose words are accepted on faith by all people, are indoctrinated to view psychedelics as worse than poison.

You see, I have discovered that as human beings, the only thing we fear more than death, is insanity; losing our mind.

So, here I am, claiming that all the answers we seek about the meaning of life are obtainable personally and verifiable by all, through certain plants.

We should have a field of science in universities, devoted to studying these plants empirically, IMHO.

Instead, we are indoctrinated to believe these plants are the worst things that exist on earth.

I really thought we were past the subject of psychedelics. But I was wrong.

-f

[sh]

Also, I've been taking psychedelics since I was 16. I've taken so many different drugs, so many times, that by all means I should be beyond insane at this point.

Am I insane now? Or should I be expecting it later?

-f

[sh]

And you know, what really bothers me, is that I know with absolute certainty that if I were to present these ideas to a wide audience, I would get dismissed very calmly and rationally, just as that language article was dismissed entirely and whole by Jennifer and Azazel, with their oh-so-reasonable voices and arguments.

We are hopeless. Or maybe I am hopeless. I haven't really decided yet.

-f

[sh]

Don't you guys feel it's odd that we don't have a scientific investigation going on into death?

Shouldn't we, as intelligent beings, be investigating such a thing?

Do you, personally, feel like there is anything more important than knowing why you are here? and what's going to happen to you?

-f

[sh]

I'll have you know Anthropologists today, maintain that one of the main functions of shamans in primitive societies was/is being a psychopomp.

Anthropologists state, that in Amazonian tribes, like the Yanomama peoples for example, the shamans behave very differently than the rest of the tribe. They describe the shaman's behavior as abnormal in that he doesn't live in the main settlement and he doesn't take part in any of the normal activities with the rest of the tribe. No one knows where he goes or what he does. He just shows up whenever he is needed and then disappears.

The shamans are usually described as very eccentric. They exhibit a complete disregard and indifference towards issues regarding the "daily life." They spend most of their time in solitude.

According to anthropologists, these primitive peoples believe that the shaman isn't even human really, that he just looks human.

-f